iDIDJ Australia Didgeridoo Cultural Hub

Hi All, I'm still a pretty new didj player, I started playing last november and I haven't been able to stop since.

I didn't see a place to put "non traditional playing" related topics so if this is in the wrong place then please move it.

I recorded myself doing a little bit of freestyle, not perfect at all, I miss a few of the horn notes (still working on those) and it's not the best in terms of planning, I sort of just sat down and let it flow, the first rhythm I tried I think is called a Cassowary (spelling?) rhythm, I heard Ash Dargan play something similar once so I tried my own hand at it. The other rhythms are ones I've either come up with myself or have twisted from other players.

The instrument itself is a Chad Butler tuned to a perfect G. It's about 4 years old so it's broken in a good bit, it's a great player and is definitely a step up from the PVC pipe I learned to circular breath on haha!

Anyway, I would really appreciate some comments and constructive criticism as to how to improve, the horns are still a work in progress but anything else anyone can help me with would be great!

http://www.box.net/shared/bere9ehm4k

Will

Hi Will,

No-one else put the welcome mat out for you so I will, welcome to the iDIDJ Forum!!!!

Most people on here are focussed or obsessed (hehehehe) with the traditional styles of play, but this section is ok for your post, maybe Meet and Greet might have been suitable but not to matter, I can move it there later.

Anyway, nice playing, I don't really have a critique of your playing, it sounds good, your overtones/horn notes are ok, could be a bit sharper but that just comes with practice. Timing is a little bit off in parts mostly where the horn notes are bunched. How do you want to improve like who do you aspire to play like and who are your didgeridoo idols? Knowing that will allow give us more direction in how to guide you.

Happy didjing and hope to see you around again!

Guan

Hi Guan

First off, thank you for the welcome

Well, I really want to just improve my overall tone/technique, there are no teachers here on Guam so I'm 100% self taught which was especially frustrating when learning my circular breathing etc.. so I'm really looking for a resource to learn and get better with.

Basically I would like to learn about what I've heard called "hard tongue" style, I've found some info on it but I would really like to learn how to apply it to my playing and such. I've heard a few sound samples of it and it's quite intriguing to me.

Since you asked about some of my idols, well I've just started so I don't know of that many players but some of the ones I like are Ondrej Smeykal, Ash Dargan, Larry Winniwinni (spelling?) and the didj maker Djalu something or other, his name escapes me but I recall seeing him play a fantastic slow rhythm a while back on youtube and I really would like to learn how to play like that (I'll see if I can find the video). I realize that might be a bit much to expect to learn to play like that but hey, if you pick a big target you have a much higher chance of hitting it.

So that's basically it, I would like to learn some of the traditional techniques and rhythms and just apply them to my playing. Where would you recommend I start? or do you need more info?

Hi Will
Welcome again to the forum from the UK. If you want to learn and get advice on trad techniques then this is the best forum to help you. All my playing techniques have been learn't/copied either from CD's, Guans clips on YouTube and files and advice from members here so don't despair. Ideally it would be nice to get one on one instruction from a yidaki master but in principle most of us have to make the best of what we have and joining this forum is one of the best and first steps on that path. The "hard tongue" CD can be purchased from Guan here, not sure if he has stock or not at the moment, this will give you a good grounding in trad tongue and rhythm techniques, practice them over and over again as once you have a "good" tongue things will start to improve for you, it takes time a practice but it will come and then you can move a bit further down the path. Pick out a few "Youtube" clips, short slowish ones that you can get your head round, break them down small bits at a time and try to copy them etc. Try to emulate the sound you hear and when you get stuck, cos you will!! ask on the forum. There are some good players here that can offer advice. I noticed that the second rhythm on your soundfile has a sort of tradish sound to it was that intentional? and with your horn notes try to pretend you are spitting a fruit pip out of your mouth, If you want a longer horn note just start the same and keep exhaling. I have made a short sound file to give you the idea, anyway good luck you are aleady on your way, trad(with all it's variations) is a great and sometimes hard and frustrating style to learn but this is how the didgeridoo is supposed to be played and we are priviledged to be allowed to try to understand and play it.

Paul

Hi Paul

Thanks for the soundclips and advice, I'll definitely work on that. However do you have some good solid basic rhythms you could perhaps post? I feel like I have absolutely no idea how to get started the youtube rhythms are good but I'm not that good at breaking down what they're doing yet since I'm not that skilled.

With hard tongue rhythms does it basically involve using strikes of the tongue against the roof of the mouth? Some of the players on youtube seem to have a quick "pop" to their sound. not exactly sure what they're doing though

Hi Kirk

Basically, yes with all traditional playing the tongue is heavily involved, particulary "hard tongue" where the basic rhythm ("dith du dhirrl") involves strong tongue movements. The "pop" you mention could be very quick "Dup" like the horn note on my file but a lot quicker and not so loud or it could be the thing that I am practicing at the moment with Guans help where it is a combination of throat and lip movement. This is on the "my freestyle" thread on this section of the forum, have a look, mainly the second page of the thread. The "hard tongue CD would be a good place start as there is spoken instruction before each sound sample but in the meantime check out the site (link below) particulary chapter two where you will get a good insight into NE Arnhem Land Yidaki playing as there are sound samples and visuals to help you see the tongue movements in action.

http://www.yirrkala.com/yidaki/dhawu/index.html

All the best Paul

Hi Kirk,

Let me join Guan in welcoming you here. As Paul mentioned already, this is indeed the best place to learn about many things you are curious about.

The player you referred to as playing slow rhythms could be Darry Dikkarna Brown? His style is different to other players such Larry or Djalu (WAL style versus NEAL style (hard tongue)). Just browse thru old posts and you can find astonishing amount of information here.

One more thing, you might need to get a more suited instrument (in case what you have right now is not of desired characteristics for- especially- NEAL style) to allow you to learn and practice in an easier way.

Enjoy it

Mahir

Hi Will

Not sure if this is the clip you are thinking about but this will give you something to get your teeth into and aspire to, a classic piece of Djalu Gurruwiwi playing. Djalu prefers to play what we would now call "slower traditional rhythms" as he is not, as far as I am aware, too keen on the fast renditions of trad tunes. Slower only in comparison to the now younger generation of players many of whom, overflowing with youthful exuberance and energy, fire off these rhythms at often machine gun speed, some of which almost defy belief!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yh_jHXxJBHA

Have fun

Paul

Hi Paul, yes! that is the clip I was referring to, I was wondering where it was lol

I like the slower pace Djalu takes with his music, I don't nessecarily dislike speed, but I want to make sure I can nail a good slow groove first before I try to tackle an Elijah Gunydjurruwuy style breakdown. At the moment I like mid tempo rhythms but I'll definitely see if I can imitate the rhythm Djalu is playing here, imitate being the key word lol if I post my attempt at it would you be willing to critique it as well?

Mahir, I haven't heard of Darry before, how does his style differ from Djalu's or Larry's?

Hi Will,
Here is one vid of Darryl's playing. : http://www.youtube.com/ididjaustralia#p ... r6pukRt6DY

On the youtube channel of IDIDJ, there are plenty of vids of Darryl playing Mago ( Mago of West Arnhem Land versus yirdaki of North East Arnhem Land). Roughly spaking, WAL is an overtone-absent style which relies on the tongue gliding hence producing slower rhythmes than NEAL which you are practising now, using rapid tongue movement and overtones.

I embarked on my did adventure when I heard WAL style for the first time . For that reason , it is dear to me. But basically, they are all beautifully different and worth exploring in my opinion.

Hi since I posted the above to help Will with his horn notes I was corrected(and rightly so) by an experienced player who kindly mailed me and explained that I was doing it all backwards!!! To be honest I hadn't really giving much thought to how I was making my toots(horn notes) but I was aware that after the toot, sometimes I didn't seem to be exactly in the right place, tongue wise, to get a smooth transition into the playing (if that makes sense?). Analysing what was actually taking place in my mouth during the "spit" toot I realised that indeed I was doing the exact reverse to what Yolngu players do when they sound a "toot". With a "spit" toot the tongue starts between the lips and as you "spit" the tongue draws back and the lips close quickly to give the toot. With the Yolngu "toot" the tongue starts back in the mouth, similar to the retroflex position, and is flicked forward to hit the back of the teeth whilst the lips tighten, along with a little push of air, this makes the toot. This toot gives a lot more cushioned, natural sound and allows the playing to flow much more naturally after the toot. I have been doing the toot wrong for a about 3 years!!! so I now need to consciously practise the correct method to undo the wrong habit. Just shows you doesn't it sometimes we don't really listen. Heres a link where Djalu shows us how its done!!

http://www.yirrkala.com/yidaki/dhawu/14trumpet.html

So Will, the spit toot will indeed work ok and you can play like this depending on how you see it and the styles you are playing but as you have heard, traditional players do it differently and I like to get things right so thats the way I am going to try to play it from now on. Any other thoughts on this anyone?

Paul

Hi Paul

So basically for the horn you're just sharpening the embouchure quickly to get the quick change in pitch when the tongue strikes the front of the teeth?

yes, (the back of the teeth!) with a little extra push of air and all timed to perfection!!!!

Paul