iDIDJ Australia Didgeridoo Cultural Hub

Hey Guys what are your thoughts on this one....

In the last few years I got several Cds on tradtional playing styles, techniques, incl. Djalu-teaches and plays Yidaki.
After I was happily out with Guan & Friends at Buffolow Creek NT, 2010 I strated to get a hang of what they were about and how you play this style.
I picked a few favourite rhythmss, practice hard...

Now I got asked, who taught you to play this, you are not permitted to play this, only if you are a family member. You could get killed out there for doing so.

I was angry and surprised at this arrogant approche...

I know each song & rhythm belongs to a family, but well they are on a Cd which you can buy online or in shops.
How come another white guy can come up to me, telling me I am not allowed to play this kind of stuff it is tabu for us.

In all respect to Yolnu Law and Culture... if it is so, why in the first place has this media then been released? And why do we then find a lot of encouriging material in the internet, trying to help us improve our playing, perhaps developing a love, and if you are sensitive enought perhaps feel more behind the rhythms when getting close on playing proper. Same thing for the master-classes & garma, where the Yolnu are happy to help out if you have a question, in my experiance.

Thanks for sharing your views.
Gordon

Hi Gordon,

I hope you are well Buddy!

As I see it is one of the most important things we trad fans need to deal with!
I have asked the guys at Buffao crk about it also Djalu and the Family. As I understand it is ok if you are taught by Yolngu. In this case we are under control, so we get access to the knowledge we are allowed to know. The other side is how we use this gift….
I think it is not ok to learn from cds on our own way and play it without any permission.

Take care Gordon, all the best!

Cheers,
John

Hi Gordon, hi John!

Here's my take on it, it depends on context, no-one will know what you play in private, nor can anyone control what you play in private. At the other extreme is performing at a paid gig. It would not be right I think in playing full traditional songs in such a context for 2 reasons I can think of: A) representational issues - you might misrepresent songs or play them incorrectly etc. B) Ethical considerations - Aboriginal owners of the songs should exclusively benefit, commercially, from their songs or at least have control over commercial use of their intellectual property.

In between there's all sorts of scenarios and contexts. If you were playing in a park or showing a friend some tips or perhaps even busking, I think it'll be ok to play what you've learnt from Yolngu even attempts at playing full songs.

But I don't think any of us will be killed by Yolngu lolz Djalu has been known to lose his temper at times and has threatened to spear certain persons, he's done the same thing too with Yolngu family, but it doesn't go any further than this. When he's upset you'll know he's upset.

John's last sentence "I think it is not ok to learn from cds on our own way and play it without any permission" sums it up I reckon, always ask for permission if unsure, let Yolngu know what you're doing and ask for a response. It might be useful for us to attempt to draft a set of guidelines when it comes to issues like this, an extension of the Garma Yidaki Statement?

Cheers,

Guan

Hi guys,
Spiky topic here...
To my mind, tuition CDs are made for Balandas to learn trad' styles and techniques.
The material in the CDs (should it be Djalu's, Milay's, Darryl's or other) are meant to be spread as they are clearly tuition CDs, unlike field-recordings which are snap-recordings of ceremonies.
Hence, still to my mind, YES, Balandas are allowed to play the songs taught on these CDs.
Yolngu (and other tribes') traditions are still preserved as only a few songs are taught on these CDs, it is not exhaustive... furthermore, I really think the masters who share their trad'songs have thought about it carefully, selected which ones they'll share, and to what extent.
Of course, Balandas should not pretend to play the REAL thing, we can only merely say we play our own version of it.
And we may only master the rhythms and techniques and musicality, but not the essence and spirituality behind them as we don't live on the land where the song originates and hence don't know the hidden messages behind.
I think that as long as an introductory (or conclusive) speech is clearly given to a trad'like performance (saying it's copycat and not the real-deal, just for the audience to get an idea of what trad' sounds), then it cannot be misinterpreted and it's ok.
I once performed for a conference on traditional healing-plants where Aboriginal bush-medecine was put forward. Central Desert paintings where exposed all around the place, but the Aboriginal mob present came from south of Sydney. They looked at me weirdly, fearing they'll be mixed up with Yolngus after having been mixed up with Pitantjatjara and Warlpiri... It feeled a bit odd to play in this context. Before pulling the yidakis I brought, I made a speech to really separate these areas and tribes (paintings, those who did the trip and where in the audience, and yidaki), then I clearly said that what I was going to perform were not traditional songs but imitations of them as I did not have the right nor skills to pretend so.
After the show, the Aboriginal mob came to me and said they really appreciated what I said and we became friends.
So it's just a question of knowing what you're doing, not pretending to know more than you do, respecting the roots and playing with your heart.


Indeed Guan, that's the best option... but practically : this can only be done if you're living in the Top-End.
How can you ask permission if you're not living with them ?

Well said Francis!

About how to go about asking for permission, there are enough family members that online these days especially through social networking sites that its not so hard now to ask questions to Yolngu directly. Airg.com and Facebook are both popular among Yolngu. The online world is penetrating into Indigenous lives, there's no limit to the reach of the cyber world...

Guan

Sure Guan, but problem with the cyber-world is that it blurs the information we're trying to exchange.
Real-life conversation with Yolngu is already very blurry due to language barrier, accents, and what we put behind the words...
Cyber-life conversation is even harder in my experience :-p
And I don't know how a custodian might decide whether or not a guy from the other-side of the world that he never heard of should be allowed or not to do something he might not even understand the purpose.
Real-life + 1st hand dialogue being the best for sure !

Yea face-to-face interaction is better but not possible for all though, I guess it depends on developing relationships through continued interaction either through cyberspace or in the real world.

G

Hey Guys,

thanks for the backing

I sure agree... I would not be appropriate if we play on conferences, big money gigs, representing Yolnu culture... It just doesn´t feel right to do so.
And I too agree, if these Cds have been published for us, to listen, learn and perhaps take something in, why shouldn´t we do so. If we have questions Thank Guan we have a good forum,

It will never EVER !!! be the same, if not learning in the top end, listening to the singing, feeling the Yidaki in your hands, chest and heart. I guess if we are lucky enough we might comprehend 1 or 2 % of what is actually going on, but at least it´s 1 or 2
I am very thankful for my experiences

But what we can do, is be humbled about it, talk with our heart about it, mention the culture, our experiences within and perhaps make people aware that traditional playing style is not just boring repetitive stuff but a story about law and the creation time for Yolnu, even if we don´t know it´s context.

I often get the impression people out there just don´t have a clue, some believe if a native friend from WA or NSW pics up a Didgeridoo and screams through it, it must be traditional style. It makes me sad, so I hope through my playing and talking how I started learning in the top end, will open peoples eyes, getting them more sensitive to the matter.

Thx
G,

I like you Gordon. I think you do have a clue.

I am not so sure though that we should assume that because a recording is available it is OK to appropriate.

I too had the same idea that maybe I could help open people's eyes by sharing what I learned in the top end. Big failure. The only thing that worked was to take some friends there to experience it first hand.



Exactly.

Hey Guys,
I do to struggle with this question and I think it requires a lot off thinking and feeling what I can, should and shouldn't do... I am so enthousiastic about Yolngu culture/music and I really get annoyed by people and what they sometimes put out on their websites etc. So much Bullsh#it on the web... But at the same time I find it hard because the line of what I can and cann't say or claim about what I know is really thin...
Maybe sometimes I cross this line, but that would be purely out of enthousiasm... I try to refer to the Yidaki dhäwu page and this forum as much as possible and by talking about Yolngu culture in my class, here in Apeldoorn, I got about 5 people to go to the Garma and Arnhemland and learn directly from Yolngu.
My biggest dream would be to invite Yolngu to come to Holland so people can listen and learn first hand.
On the Yidaki dhäwu site Djalu says that: "...When you have money from teaching, share it with us...." So I try to invest as much as I can into getting proper Yidaki etc. for people here in Holland so they can get a feeling what this instrument is about...
Although sometimes I get the feeling some people really don't care about where it originates... they just want to take...
All my students here in Apeldoorn understand that I know no more then as much as let's say, a 2 year old from Arnhemland and that what I say and teach is my personal and contempory interpetation of this music, this way I encourage them to buy CD's and go to workshops, watch video's and learn...
I hope I am doing the right thing and I keep checking with people if it is real what I am doing...
I am trying to be humble, respectfull and pay back when I can...

Hi together ...

Some days before that theme hit me to. Found that thread here right now and I want to share my point of view.
What are we going for with the Didgie? For me it is totaly incomprehensible playing sounds which are not "mine" ...

But I won't establish it with money or business or something like that.
It's (also) about an basement of creativity - I don't have part on that aboriginal culture - so creativity and musicality is all I can go for - ok, beside a healing effect to myself!
I can not imagine replaying sounds because it's like beeing a clone for me ... what about passion, spirit and aspiration for individual sounds - lost - never there?

I read a quote of Djalu I got from an other Didge player during I was in touched with that toppic.

A part of it:

"It's good, we will share our laws. You come here to listen, and we give to you. We shouldn't mistrust each other. No matter if you're not Aboriginal, you should respect our law. Later we will stand up together and dance with many spears. Others will join with the Yol\u and dance. That's good."

For myself ... I don't know aboriginal laws till now, but I know mine.

And mine is - be yourself to be able to go that far away with that beautiful instrument and don't retard yourself!
It's given away time of life from my point, cause I do not stay that closed to myself as I need to. Looking forward straight and sincere.

I'm just a jung dude belongs to the didgie .. and I even do not know so much about the aboriginal history - but I am interested in, and it will change by time.
So that is my point belongs to that!

Greetz from an urban mind

Jo

Hi Jo,

Welcome to the forum mate! I was thinking about your question a few days ago from Facebook and I'm glad you came on here because I wanted to write something.

Oops sorry, I got distracted and I didn't write anything for a while

Anyway, what I was going to say is that the didgeridoo is quite a personal thing, each didgeridoo player sees something different in it. When I play didgeridoo, for example, it isn't so much about being creative although there is quite a lot of creativity in the freestyle yidaki genre in eastern Arnhem Land. It is about using traditional technique to create new and beautiful sounding rhythms and syncopations. Some people might think that there should only be one way to play the didgeridoo and that is the traditional way, I'm not one of those people, but there are Aboriginal guys in Arnhem Land for instance who would think it is silly to play any other style, to hear a different style might be maybe not disrespectful to them but perhaps amusing? Some of the younger guys might think that, Djalu isn't like that of course, one of the first things he does when he meets a new didgeridoo player is to listen to his style before proceeding to anything else. He's appreciative of people's own individual styles and enjoys hearing others play when they can play to a high level of competence whatever style it is.

By playing traditional style as outsiders not born into the culture, I don't see a moral issue there, I don't see it as copying either, what I would say is that if we applied the same rules to the didgeridoo as we do to any other musical instrument, our conclusions might be quite different. After all, when one learns djembe or harmonic singing or flute or trombone, we usually learn from someone who has the foundational skills and knowledge base of the instrument, in the case of the didgeridoo, these people are the traditional custodians of the instrument in the Top End of Australia. That's my thinking anyway. But the didgeridoo is such a "free" instrument with so many sonic possibilities and I don't try to discourage people from playing any style they choose, in fact I'm getting to like quite a lot of contemporary playing by today's top exponents of the craft in Europe and the US. In the same breath, I also get excited meeting like-minded trad enthusiasts

The didgeridoo is a little bit like the mouth organ in that both have really grown and expanded musically compared to other musical instruments where conventions and norms are more closely observed.

Again, welcome Jo and feel free anytime to drop in and have a chat!

Cheers,

Guan

.. love to read that! You wrote down some good points for me ... of course it should'nt be on discouraging and it should be free as we are.

At least everybody is free to decide it for himself.
Right, I learned Trumpet and Bass Guitar in my youth for example - but I learned how to use the instrument to create sounds, ...... but there is no reason to me, to keep it forced that hard and declarative anyway ... at least it is just my personal point of view ... and I'm failable as everyone. ... it might be different when you're playing in an orchester where it have to fit to each others playing. Hm .. new input I'm explaining myself^^ .. I never thought about that.

At least, love to read, that it's also about experimenting in Arnhemland that is what music is for me about - a rising way of audible evolution!

Thanks for welcome me Guan

Jo